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Australia maintains rage against Obama's Iraq policy
Feb 12, 2007, 0:03 GMT
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Older Talkback
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It is exactly because of incompetent sick-in-the-head neocon freaks like Howard and Downer and our very own imbecile Bush that we are in the mess we're in.
They screwed it up!!! And, they will NOT admit to their FAILURE!!!
They are NEVER going to let go of their phony little war in Iraq because by doing so they will reveal themselves as the bumbling fumbling blubbering fools that they are!!!
John Howard is as clueless as Bush as to the best option for their withdrwal in this lost cause. If Howard is so enamoured by the Iraq War, let him send more Australian troops. As usual it is AlQaeda the bogeyman. Tell the 200,000 dead, wounded and displaced Iraqis and others who have needlessly died since the US led invasion about the dangers of AlQaeda. Would all these needless killing and suffering be there if the unilateral US and its moronic sidekicks Howard and the liar Blair led invasion had taken place? Saddam may have been a killer but US has caused far more deaths and sufferings than Saddam during his dictatorship. Diplomatic steps would have been more humane than the warmongering actions of the three stooges, Bush, Blair and Howard. They will go down in history in the same category of mass murderers such as Hitler.
Bush, Howard and their likes ahe the real threat to this world. They are the true TERRORISTS. They hate western democracy and values and would like to do away with them much more than anyone else.
Obama slapped the guy down in such a genteel way.
Obama scores a few more points...
Hey, I think that you all are being far too critical of the Iraq war. As far as the 300,000 Iraquis that have died, well that's war. Many Iraqis invited the US coalition. Before you start arguing and pointing fingers at our elected government officials, then maybe you should look at the facts first and realize that Saddam Hussein was a serial killer. Only a heartless asadine idiot would want him to still be in power there. And to put them in the same category as Hitler is retarded.
I'm happy to see so many comments against Howard and his war-mongering imperialist buddies. As an Australian, I am embarassed so often when Australia follows the US in war or ignoring the Kyoto Protocols, and voting for (or not voting against) Israel at the UN. This article has the title 'Australia mantains rage....' but I think and hope most ordinary Australians are against this war. And as for the argument that Barrack Obama encourages terrorism, the continuing war encourages terrorism much more! And war IS terror.
When John Howard signs up his whole family to go fight on the front lines, patroling Baghdad streets, then his opinion will carry some weight. Until then he can keep his opinions to himself and hide under his desk.
Howard was right, unless you lives in islamic country as non moslem you have no idea what freedom really is, if you don't want to fight them over there, you will fight them on your own street one day.
Please read testimony of former Iraqi general George Sada on WMD.
http://www.amazon.com/Saddams-Secrets-General-Survived-Hussein/dp/B000G YI1QU/sr=8-1/qid=1171244199/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/002-4226595-4565669?ie=UTF8&s=b ooks
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Sada
Mr. Howard would rightly resent any American interference in Australia's internal politics. Until Mr. Obama is elected, his positions are for domestic consumption. So, Mr. Howard needs to learn to be a bit more circumspect.
As for 20,000 troops being half his military - if he feels al Qaida is on a world wide vendetta, it might behoove him to increase its size rather than depending on the United States to protect him.
Its easy for the Democratzis to play Monday morning quarterback and second guess the President. At the time, most of them voted to invade Iraq, and now pretend like they had nothing to do with it, or were otherwise 'deceived' into supporting the war. This from the party that claims to be so brilliant as they deride the Administration for stupidity. Aside from running from the fight, we have yet to hear anything from them that offers a plan for Iraq. The nearest they have come to strategy is to suggest we open a 'dialog' with those sworn to murder us, as we abandon the Iraqis and run for home.
The Australians have it exactly right. The Democratzs have indeed become the party of the enemy. Despite all of their indignation at being accused of not supporting our combat troops, they have done nothing but offer aid and comfort to the enemy. They have politicized the war to the point were victory has become nearly impossible. They whined for more troops in the war, then ranted against the 'surge' once it was begun. Success in this war has never been in their interest, and they have done everything they can to prevent it. They are clearly the party of choice for terrorists, and they have proved to be predictable and dependable useful idiots for them. I'm sure they look forward to '08 with unrestrained glee.
Let Iraq deal with its own bloody mess. We shall defend ourselves when necessary.
Obama needs to get his facts straight. Furthermore, no one should have invaded an unappreciative country.
It's no secret that John Howard has long G.W.Bush's loyal lap dog.
Australia's contributtion role in Irap is supportive / non-combat.
Pershap John Howard should put his troops in combat zone
(like the US). When the body bags start fly home en-mass,
Mr.-Me-Too would understand the situation and stop messing
with other country's affairs.
God Bless John Howard, a man of vision if ther ever was one.
'Bush is a man of steel' We need more men like Bush to keep the crying democrats free.
If Downer wants to sleep with Bush and not Obama, how about we send
The numan nature is quite an amusing one...
Once the indigiones population in Australia and America was exterminated, stripped of all assets and locked up in reservation - the time has come to promote the 'human rights' in all other places, particularely where the oil or some other valuable 'national interests' could be found.
The British, if I am not mistaken, already have being in places like Afganistan and Iraq, way before 9/11 but surely due to some other not less importand calendar day - the Queen's birthday maube?
And the brave Australians always would folow and give a helping hand to their old masters or any new master - the old wone would recommend. So, when a new master called for help in Vietnam - the brave Australians where ready without asking too many questions. Except, maybe, what is the rate of return for a dollar spent...
'God Bless John Howard, a man of vision if ther ever was one'
Moreover, a man of a double-vision ... and double standards if I may.
What really pisses me off is not so much criminality of the West but the mask they wear to hide their real intentions and deeds.
What you have to know about John Howard is his racist background. His father and grandfather owned plantations in Australia's colony Papua New Guinea. On those plantations 'blacks' worked like slaves to gain a profit for his family. Howard has been reluctant to own up to his family's racist past although his has unleashed a number of racist policies in Australia.
I wonder what Bush official put the puppet John Howard on notice that he must come to the aid of the dying Bush Administration? If Mr Howard thinks that this is such a lovely war why doesn't he offer up 20,000 or 30,000 of those fearless Aussie troops to the slaughter. Whats the matter, chicken?
If the commenters on this thread don't think Saddam was a huge threat to the security of the middle east, then you probably were not around for the Iran-Iraq war, the Kuwait invasion by Iraq, the Gulf War(Where Syria, Egypt, Saudi Arabia were among our allies), the many, many UN Security Council resolutions finding Iraq non-compliant in honoring resolutions or their mandates, the many bombings by President Bill Clinton, gassing of The Iraqui Kurds, slaughter of many thousand of Iraqui Shia after the Gulf War, the burning of the Kuwait oil fields upon fleeing back to Iraq and those oil wells burnt for many months afterward. Then there is UNSC resolution 1441, demanding Saddam disarm and allow further inspections of the WMD programs. The UN Security council voted 15-0 to support action against Iraq, but France opposed military action, so did Russia and China. Turns out they were the three leading benefactors(along with Germany)in the oil-for-food program, administered by the United Nations to help Iraqui population. You all are hopeless if you can't see that after 911 the US tried for over a year to work diplomatically with Iraq through the United Nations. Can you see a pattern occuring with Iran today? The US will just get criticized by toe the line Socialist/communist/ liberal followers who don't learn the history or the facts, if and when military action is required. Please do yourself a favor and wikipedia United Nations Security Council resolution 1441--being informed is not easy, but well worth the investment of time.
If Howard is racist and Australians elected him in a free and democratic way, then a formal logic would lead to some unpleasent but inevitable conclusion about many Australians.
Am I surprised? Not at all.
If Saddam was such a huge threat to the security of the middle east, then you may wonder how come he was an American and British friend during Iran-Iraq war?
How come he was suplied by a western technologies to produce WMD in a first place? How come he was never criticized whan using this WMD against Iranians an, Kurds and Shia then?
Somehow for the West, Saddam became a brutal dictator only AFTER the war with Iran he waged on behalf of Saudi Arabia and its Western friends. And, if a dictatorship is the evil, the West is chasing the world for a major cleanup - how come the West-friendly dictators are smiling everuwhere, including in Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Yemen, Egipt and others?
The West is never adverse to brutal dictatorships as long as they friendly and obedient. They always prefered a friendly dictator to free elected leftist.
Democracy eaten ... is a democracy learned.
'...benefactors(along with Germany)in the oil-for-food program...'
as well a dosen or so american companies and australian ones as well.
Well, at least it was an oil-for-food. Today's benefactors of an oil-for-bombs program are less well-known but not less effective. Abnd much deadlier too.
when the French and Germans said that youll are
going to have a problem in invading Iraq you did not believe them.
Also, you condemed them. Now face the consequences.
Very few people seem to realize just how self-serving and opportunistic the Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld and beneficiary cronies in-waiting (Haliburtan et al) were to start this invasion in the first place. Remember Iraq was two-thirds contained vis-a-vis the 'no-fly zone' established by the U.S. after the invasion of Kuwait. Regardless of what the Bush administration was trying to sell about the supposed research of chemical and biological weapons, Saddam could hardly open a new variety store without the world knowing about it. The only chemical weapons Saddam could possibly have had were the ones left over from the war with Iran that were supplied by none other than America. The only argument that at first glance may appear to hold some worth, is the idea that Saddam was dictator who kept is grip by killing and subverting the Iraq population. Two things and as much as I hate this phrase, make no mistake this war was all about oil and putting a war machine to work. Second even if you buy into the idea that it was for the noble cause of liberating a nation of a tyrant...this is for the Iraq people to solve. I think the international community has every right to voice there opinions especially when results of elections can effect world events. I also think that until the American elections force this current administration out of office the world will continue to decline into a deeper and deeper quagmire. I believe Obama is the right person to become the next president of the United States. Hurry up 2008!!!
One thing that has escaped the attention of most people is that, unlike the US or the UK, Howard has not mobilized his reserves to fight in Iraq. He keeps complaining that he does not have the troops to commit to Iraq, but he is unwilling to use those who are already trained for just such emergencies.
By the way, do you know how many Australians have been killed by enemy action in Iraq? ZERO. That’s right, absolutely none. The only Australian soldier ever to have died in Iraq was as a result of the discharge of his own weapon.
I hear the British soldiers in Southern Iraq have been complaining about the Australians having been carefully wrapped in cotton wool and put in places where they cannot come to any harm. The joke is that the most strenuous thing the Aussies face each day is having to walk across the Saudi border every afternoon to have tea with the Saudi National Guard.
Howard the Coward shoots off his mouth again. There was no al Qaida presence in
Iraq before Israel's lap dogs Bush and Howard invaded the place. Of course saying
Howard and Bush invaded is poetic license. Their ilk always send better men than
themselves to do the dying.
Did you know Austrailians drink recycled sewage because their government is too
incompetent to provide water any other way? Look it up. It's true.
After the stuff Howard the Coward feeds them, they probably can't tell the difference
anyhow.
Ah
John Howard. Coward.
Howard the Coward wants to lectue when he himself has sent the least possible number of Australian troops possible --- to non-combat duty -- in Iraq. HAAAA!
Hypocrite.
John Howard is absolutely correct, that gives him a right to an opinion. Brave Australians have been killed in this war, that gives him the right to an opinion.
Australians have been our strong allies since we were attacked, they have fought on in Afghanistan as well as Iraq and they have been bombed in Bali for their trouble. We owe them a debt of gratitude, as well as the other members of the coalition who have stood with us, some far more reluctantly then the Australians.
So it embarrasses me as an American to see ungrateful idiots denigrating John Howard. Especially for telling that pandering, substantialness, unelectable child Barak Obama not to undercut the mission when there are still Australian (and American)lives at risk.
I just wish our politicians had such clear vision and courage to articulate it, and that we didn't have a population that just wants eye candy and ass kissing.
Regardless, well said Mr. Howard.
Big mistake for Howard to make and he knows it. Unfortunately in politics even your mistakes must be defended to death because admitting fault shows that your are a fool.
www.myapologetics.com
Please! Australia does not maintain its rage. John Howard maintains his own blinkered, irrational and increasingly out-of-touch rage.
Try not to blame Australia for John Howard, and we'll try not to blame the US for George Bush!
Bush - Howard the coward - Blair - Merkel
They're ALL work for their Gods chosen Jewish masters.
the biggest thing with war mongereres is their lack of information
please asess the situation and what has happend in the last three years over hundreads of thousands of people have died in iraq more then during all the people killed in saddams time and majority of them were killed in wars which the US participated and even supported in
even better ask an iraqi what prefer meaning someone from bagdad he tell you clearly saddam was better then this situation and want US withdrawl only reason there isnt a withdrawl is shia coalition want to Use the americans to clear the sunnis out of iraq and carry genocide against them so after that they would themselves demand US to withdraw or rise themselves
these warmonger massmurders bush, blair and howard far worse then you people think
My first reaction was 'Howard who?' Then: 'Australia?' Later (on hearing Sen. Obama's response) I snickered. PM Howard better watch out. He's making Obama the underdog and America loves an underdog.
lol you americans are abunch of gutless wonders, jumping up and down about how you have to take our saddam even we here in Australia told you that would be a mistake, but for our sins we helped you anyway what did you think would happen?
now you have trashed the place destroyed their infrastructure you want to run like a bunch of whipped dogs, you have a responsibility to at least rebuild critical infrastructure. the question isnt 'should we run like girls' it should have been 'should we go there to begin with?'
you can declaim bush and howard all you like but it doesnt detract from the fact that no matter how much you dont want to hear it howard spoke the truth of the matter.
even the most brain dead red neck hick has to see how totally stupid it is to tell your enemy when your leaving.
for gods sake you people have been given brains im not advocating for people to vote republican im advocating that you people for once use that thing on your shoulders called a head.
JT is correct.
I am an American, and I can not stand all of the anti-war crap that is spewing from both sides of the aisle.
Can people not seewhat a catastrophe it would be to leave Iraq at a given date? If you can't see that, then you really have no clue what is happening in the world today.
Most people in the US really have no clue why 9/11 even took place, or why we went to Iraq, or why we are still in Iraq.
People should educate themselves on the issue rather than just proclaim that we must get out of there NOW at whatever cost.
That is the worst thing that could possibly happen. Should we be there? No. Do we have a choice? Not really.
Face it, we are there until the Iraqi government can handle the situation by themselves. No matter how long that takes. An early pull out, or putting caps or whatever, just ties us down even more. Have we learned nothing from Vietnam? Clearly Congress has no idea how to wage a war, they never have. Any war they meddle in we lose.
Let the Generals on the ground determine what they need to fight the battles. Dictating to a General that they can only do this or that is how you lose a fight....Sheesh.
the real terrorists and muderes are the war-mongers they still think they are the good people and they think they have agenda where they can think america imperialy make an agenda it wants when thwe people dont want them
a war is lost when the people are not with you who do think you are when you can go to iraq push your agenda that what your doing is right
iraq wasnt invaded by switzerland it was invaded by warmongers like you who trranyical ragimes when they want to be like uzebekistan and egypt, in their version of democracey where they have puppet ragime, control the resources threw their companies and serves isreals interests
when infact the real terrorists are them the neo-con bushes, blairs and howards
and america deserves 911 if its full of people like them
I was on the fense about Obama. I have been tonight reading everything on the web I could find on his opinions and comments. His remarks towards Howard are the smartest counter and puts Howard's remarks into perspective.
To you who support this war - No matter how much good. No matter how much little fluffy democracy we bring to the world. We could not afford it. Are we willing to drive to work on bicycles? Are we will to live in shacks and eat macaronie and cheeze for every meal? Are we willing to have no retirement, no social security and no economy? This war has impoverished us just as Vietnam did our parents.(The computer age bubble off-set it)
France financed our American Revolution and then collapsed under the weight of the interest and debt. May we not make the same mistake. They too had good reason for doing it.
Please stop referring to Bush and or Sadam as Hitler. Hilter systematically targeted and exterminated a whole race only because they were a different race. Sadam targeted whole peoples for political reasons. Bush killed people to get to Sadam for political reasons. It's ok to mass kill people as long as you have superior rational political reasons to do so. Bush is more like Ghangis Khan or Atila the Hun or Julius Ceasar who used pretext to enter into a conflict. Rational reasons like a princess that needs to be saved or putting the rightful ruler on the throne or weapons of mass destruction.
We knew what Bush was, he told us. A non-reader, scraped by college with a C, served in the Military flying planes - no record to see what his character was because his father had expunged his records.
The Lesson we as a America should learn from this:
If he had gained a classical education he would know that everytime a confinement camp is done when their is no third party oversight abuses occur: Every, Every Time. Lets see those porn pictures they didn't release to the general public. What about those people who killed our people and paraded them heads? I'm glad to see we are the equal to riff-raff. I'm glad to see that we too can be wrong and unjust.
When you invade a country it is good to have the majority of your troops schooled in the native language or have enough interpretures to attach to each unit or division. And then when your ally, France points this out, you should not talk about how FRANCE is a country of wimps and frog eating wine siping allies to Sadam. Who were so weak they needed our help in WWII. (If Hilter had been on the same continent we would have faired no better. His troops were best trained and weaponed of any military of it's day) And not listen to them who have also been classically trained and read the paper.
When you invade a country under a pretext make sure they still have the pretext that you sold to them. US sold them weapons of Mass extinction so they could antrax Iran who we were very mad at. Maybe we shouldn't sell weapons to crazy people. Soloman, Islamic conquerer of the Holy lands told his Sultan that they should keep the Christians in the Holy land instead of expelling them because they would sell any weapon to them for money. We would always know what weapons the enemy has.
Maybe we as the US should become smarter and pick a smart president or listen to someone who is(smarter).
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