Europe Features
Islam foes seek to ban minarets on Swiss mosques
By Heinz-Peter Dietrich May 18, 2007, 13:26 GMT
Geneva - Signatures by 100,000 petitioners are needed in Switzerland for a referendum - including a possible one on banning the construction of minarets on mosques.
Deputies from the far-right Swiss People's Party (SVP) and Federal Democratic Union (EDU), who are pushing for a vote, are confident they can collect the signatures by November 2008.
Swiss Foreign Minister Micheline Calmy-Rey voiced opposition this week, saying efforts to impose a ban were harmful to the country's security interests and potentially dangerous to the Swiss themselves. Her spokesman confirmed she considered a referendum a bad idea.
Calmy-Rey feels it is too risky to dismiss the campaign for a referendum as a vote-getting tactic ahead of Swiss parliamentary elections in October.
Memories are still fresh of protests in the Muslim world following the publication in Denmark of cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad.
Geneva, where Calmy-Rey was born, has had a mosque with a minaret since 1978. The structure has not bothered anyone up to now with the possible exception of some parents who have trouble finding parking spaces on Fridays - the main day of prayers - when they come to pick up their children from the nearby German School.
Another mosque with a minaret is in Zurich, directly opposite a church. There have not been any problems there either, residents say.
Nevertheless, efforts are under way to add an article to Switzerland's constitution prohibiting the construction of minarets - - a nightmare for democrats and human rights activists.
What, then, is the point of this initiative, whose opponents include the Swiss Bishops' Conference and which - as the Berner Zeitung newspaper noted - has been attacked by the Arabic television satellite station al-Jazeera and various websites?
Led by Christoph Blocher, a well-spoken industrialist, the SVP is the strongest party in the National Council, the larger of the Swiss parliament's two chambers.
It has 55 seats in the 200-seat body as well as two ministers in the Swiss government, which is elected by parliament and has representatives from all the major political parties.
Observers say the SVP is fishing for votes to hold on to power in October. The EDU, among whose aversions are abortion and same-sex partnerships, has just two seats in the National Council.
The nearly 340,000 Muslims in Switzerland, which has a population of about 7.5 million, are often the object of animosity.
According to a survey by the news magazine Facts, for the most part they practise their religion quietly in more than 140 houses of worship.
The desire to make mosques more visible has increased, however. In three Swiss cantons there are now building applications for minarets, slender towers topped by a crescent.
The foes of minarets have brought in the heavy artillery. The approximately 100 supporters of a ban, including 35 SVP deputies, declared that Islam was making a 'political-religious bid for power.'
Among the evidence they cited was a remark by Recep Tayyip Erdogan, Turkey's prime minister and ex-mayor of Istanbul, that 'the mosques are our barracks, the minarets our bayonets, the domes our helmets, and the believers our soldiers.'
This, say those seeking a referendum, must be stopped in Switzerland.
© 2007 dpa - Deutsche Presse-AgenturCOMMENT
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Older Talkback
page: 1
If the Turk PM said so, he was at least honest and not 'DIPLOMATIC' or 'DUPLICIT' AS MOST OF THE WESTERN LIAR POLITICIANS ARE. Islamic centers are our strength anywhere and everywhere in the world. If we had enough of them in 1970s, there was no way a nonmuslim intelligence could deIslamise Osama bin Laden and create a monster, and the bloodshed he has caused in Afghanistan, Iraq, Pakistan and USA. Islam does not allow it. But Nonmuslim version of Islam condones it, because that had its target. They could not achieve their target with real Islam.
WAKE UP AND READ ON REAL ISLAM!!!
Wake up Islam, Muhammed was the Charles Manson of Arabia and you are too dumb to see it.
'WAKE UP AND READ ON REAL ISLAM!!! '
You mean this one?
Taken from the Koran:
Qur'an:9:5 'Fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, harass them, lie in wait and ambush them using every stratagem of war.'
Qur'an:9:29 'Fight those who do not believe until they all surrender, paying the protective tax in submission.'
Qur'an:9:88 'The Messenger and those who believe with him, strive hard and fight with their wealth and lives in Allah's Cause.'
Qur'an:9:14 'Fight them and Allah will punish them by your hands, lay them low, and cover them with shame. He will help you over them.'
Qur'an:9:38 'Believers, what is the matter with you, that when you are asked to go forth and fight in Allah's Cause you cling to the earth? Do you prefer the life of this world to the Hereafter? Unless you go forth, He will afflict and punish you with a painful doom, and put others in your place.'
Qur'an:9:123 'Fight the unbelievers around you, and let them find harshness in you.'
Qur'an 5:51 'Believers, take not Jews and Christians for your friends. They are but friends and protectors to each other.'
Qur'an 9:29 'Fight those who do not believe in Allah or the Last Day, who do not forbid that which has been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, or acknowledge the Religion of Truth (Islam), (even if they are) People of the Book (Christians and Jews), until they pay the Jizyah tribute tax in submission, feeling themselves subdued and brought low.' [Another translation says:] 'pay the tax in acknowledgment of our superiority and their state of subjection.'
Qur'an 5:17 '...Say (Muhammad): ‘Who then has the least power against Allah, if His will were to destroy Christ, the Messiah, the son of Mary, his mother, and everyone else on earth?'
Qur'an 5:35 'Believers, fear Allah and seek the way to approach Him, striving hard, fighting Jihad with all your might in His Cause that you may be successful. As for the disbelievers [previously defined as Christians], if they had everything on earth, two times over, to give as ransom for the penalty of the Day of Doom, it would never be accepted from them. Theirs will be a painful torment. They will desire to get out of the fire, but they shall not be released from it. They shall have an everlasting torture.'
Qur'an 5:49 'And this (He commands): Judge between them by what Allah has revealed and follow not their [Christian] desires, but beware of them lest they beguile you, seducing you away from any of that which Allah hath sent down to you. And if they turn you away [from being Muslims], be assured that for their crime it is Allah's purpose to smite them. Truly most men are rebellious.'
Qur'an 5:73 'They are surely disbelievers who blaspheme and say: ‘God is one of three in the Trinity for there is no Ilah (God) except One, Allah. If they desist not from saying this (blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall them - the disbelievers will suffer a painful doom.'
Qur'an 5:77 'Say (Muhammad): ‘People of the Book, do not overstep the bounds in your religion, or follow the people who erred and led many astray. Cursed are the unbelievers among the Children of Israel by David and Jesus.... They do vile things, allying themselves with the infidels so that Allah's indignation is upon them and in torment they will suffer for all eternity.' [Another translation reads:] 'Curses were pronounced on the unbelievers, the Children of Israel who rejected Islam, by the tongues of David and of Jesus because they disobeyed and rebelled.'
Qur'an 5:80 'You see many of them allying themselves with the unbelieving infidels. Vile indeed are their souls. Allah's wrath is on them, and in torment will they abide.'
Qur'an 5:82 'You will find the Jews and disbelievers [defined as Christians in 5:73] the most vehement in hatred for the Muslims.'
Qur'an 5:117 'I only said what You (Allah) commanded me to say: Worship Allah, my lord and your Lord. I was a witness over them while I dwelt amongst them but you took me up. (This is a great admonition and warning to the Christians of the whole world.)'.
It goes on and on and on like this... A hateful fever dream instructing the islamo-zombies to use violence against the infidel.
The next thing you may hear is that Iran is making burka bikes for women, soon to come to Eurabia. Opps my bad Europe.
TO: I did Syed....
You will find the same rhetoric in the bile (i mean bible)and the Torah. These religious beliefs come from the same geographical area, with the same root hatred for anything that isn't one of them. The bibble (I mean holy babble)may say:'thou shalt not kill,' but it means thou shalt not kill a member of thine own family. Everyone else is fair game. And yet arabs, like jews, are semites. They are brothers in the same family. Cops know that the worst situation is a family dispute and hate responding to the call. So, don't disparage one side without disparaging them all.
This is pure racist, hatred and intolerance. Europeans are pure racist and evil people, they preach things that they don't care about.
How can Muslims be a threat? They only make up 2% of Switzerland and overall European population. For comparison with America, in America Muslims make up 2% of the population.
I can't believe what I am reading. This is so offensive and so clear racist, and evil. This makes me so sad.
'How can Muslims be a threat? '
How can Muslims be a threat? Well, they can hijack aircraft full of people and fly them into buildings full of people as they did in New York. They can fill school gyms full of children and set off bombs killing hundreds as they did in Beslan. They can blow up commuter trains as they have done in London, Madrid and Mumbai. They can blow up airliners as they have done over Lockerbie, Russia and have tried to do repeatedly since 9/11. They can demand that you adopt to their ways and customs rather then the other way around, or they can live in their own enclaves which are run by their laws in your countries. They could assassinate politicians or film makers or authors that they disagree with or riot and kill over cartoons. They could cut the throats of people who make bibles as was done recently in Turkey. They could have 'rape tournaments' where they rape uncovered/unvieled girls as is done in the slums of Paris or Sydney Australia.
I could go on and on here... But maybe you get the idea.
Even though Muslims don't support American foriegn policy but America is much better for Muslims and actually more tolerant than Europeans. I been in European and talked to lot of Muslim in Europe. No wonder, European Muslims are more radicalized than American Muslims, where American Muslims are more intregated in the society, more happy and more progessive than Europeans Muslims, here are reasons why.
1) European goverment like to lecture Muslims, how they should be and do but America government don't interfere in Muslims business.
2) Since America so diverse, Muslims don't feel being singled-out (except for airport), European Muslims always feel singled out since they are no minority and diverse.
3) There is now a Muslim that got elected to be in the government in America; There has never been a Muslim elected to be in government in any of European countries.
4) Muslims doesn't get discriminated much in America but European Muslims get discriminated against a lot.
5) Due large diversity in America, Muslims able to intregate and get accepted in America but not in Europe.
6) American is more religious and conservative (like no soft porn on televison or no nude beach) but in Europe, the people are too secular where most Europe countries there are soft porn in European televison all the time and nude beaches all over Europe.
'This is pure racist, hatred and intolerance.'
Islam isn't a race, it is a political ideology that masquerades as a religion.
'Europeans are pure racist and evil people'
How is that for 'hate' and 'intolerance'
'This is so offensive and so clear racist, and evil.'
I am offended by terrorism, gang rapes and intimidation of freedom of speech. Is that somehow 'evil'?
'This makes me so sad.'
Cheer up, there is a whole region of the world that embraces sharia law and all that goes with it and you are probably near an airport.
Why don't you look in the Quran with some sense and see the context. It definitley does not ask to turn the other cheek, A GRAND HYPOCRICY.
It does not say that you have no right to avenge a transgresion, YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO AVENGE, RATHER THAN HOLDING GRUDGE IN YOUR MIND AS DOES THE WHITE MONKEY MAN. but it tells you if you forgive then God Almighty will forgive you on the day of judgement.
Quraan does not say that a helpless man who was killed mercilessly by jews died for your sins, so you can commit every sin under the sun, and you will be forgiven.
QURAAN IS FOR UNDERSTANDING FIRST AND THEN PRACTICE.
LET ME CITE YOU THE BEHAVIOUR BY EVEN THE MUSLIM KINGS, SALADIN FORGAVE THE NON COMBATANT CHRISTIAN WHEN HE CONQUERED PALESTINE, WHLE THE ARROGANCE OF THE POPE KILLED EVERY MUSLIM THAT LIVED IN JERUSALEM AFTER THEY WON THE SECOND CRUSADE.
DO YOU SEE ALL THE BIBLICAL TEACHINGS ARE HYPOCRITICAL AT BEST.
'QURAAN IS FOR UNDERSTANDING FIRST AND THEN PRACTICE.'
LOL! Yeah, right. You have the audacity to post that on this thread and you post the following elsewhere:
''The hearts and thoughts of the Muslim warriors are pure; the minds of the neo-Crusaders are evidently filled with devilish intent and sin. The Muslims are pious and upright GOD-fearing people; whilst the Occident imperialists are the minions of Satan' Osama Bin Laden’s message of February 2003, as reported in BBC News, about the U.S. not having the courage and conviction to defeat the Islamists will prove to be prophetic. Soon the heroic Muslim freedom fighters will expel the cowardly Occidental devils from Islamic lands and seas. ISLAM FOR THE WORLD!'Eliminate the devils (U.S./U.K.) from the equation and there will be peace. 9 more neo-Crusaders dead and many more injured today. The Coalition of Satan is losing in Iraq and Afghanistan. The heroic Egyptian martyr, Lieutenant Colonel Khalid al Islambuli said it best, “ISLAM FOR THE WORLD...''
No thank you. Islam will not take over the world. Reason will not stand for it.
Wherever the Islam that you rant about spreads there is war, oppression, intimidation, willful ignorance and poverty. The Swiss simply do not want lying, brainwashed lunatics like you messing up their countryside with your tacky hate-houses that spread violence and barbarity.
Why does the Qur'an state these things if it really doesn't mean what it states?
ALSO: Please explain the true meanings line by line, as I don't understand the peacefull meanings of the Qur'an. Also if possible show or state the Biblical text that is equal or worse. See below:
Taken from the Qur'an:
Qur'an:9:5 'Fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, harass them, lie in wait and ambush them using every stratagem of war.'
Qur'an:9:29 'Fight those who do not believe until they all surrender, paying the protective tax in submission.'
Qur'an:9:88 'The Messenger and those who believe with him, strive hard and fight with their wealth and lives in Allah's Cause.'
Qur'an:9:14 'Fight them and Allah will punish them by your hands, lay them low, and cover them with shame. He will help you over them.'
Qur'an:9:38 'Believers, what is the matter with you, that when you are asked to go forth and fight in Allah's Cause you cling to the earth? Do you prefer the life of this world to the Hereafter? Unless you go forth, He will afflict and punish you with a painful doom, and put others in your place.'
Qur'an:9:123 'Fight the unbelievers around you, and let them find harshness in you.'
Qur'an 5:51 'Believers, take not Jews and Christians for your friends. They are but friends and protectors to each other.'
Qur'an 9:29 'Fight those who do not believe in Allah or the Last Day, who do not forbid that which has been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, or acknowledge the Religion of Truth (Islam), (even if they are) People of the Book (Christians and Jews), until they pay the Jizyah tribute tax in submission, feeling themselves subdued and brought low.' [Another translation says:] 'pay the tax in acknowledgment of our superiority and their state of subjection.'
Qur'an 5:17 '...Say (Muhammad): ‘Who then has the least power against Allah, if His will were to destroy Christ, the Messiah, the son of Mary, his mother, and everyone else on earth?'
Qur'an 5:35 'Believers, fear Allah and seek the way to approach Him, striving hard, fighting Jihad with all your might in His Cause that you may be successful. As for the disbelievers [previously defined as Christians], if they had everything on earth, two times over, to give as ransom for the penalty of the Day of Doom, it would never be accepted from them. Theirs will be a painful torment. They will desire to get out of the fire, but they shall not be released from it. They shall have an everlasting torture.'
Qur'an 5:49 'And this (He commands): Judge between them by what Allah has revealed and follow not their [Christian] desires, but beware of them lest they beguile you, seducing you away from any of that which Allah hath sent down to you. And if they turn you away [from being Muslims], be assured that for their crime it is Allah's purpose to smite them. Truly most men are rebellious.'
Qur'an 5:73 'They are surely disbelievers who blaspheme and say: ‘God is one of three in the Trinity for there is no Ilah (God) except One, Allah. If they desist not from saying this (blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall them - the disbelievers will suffer a painful doom.'
Qur'an 5:77 'Say (Muhammad): ‘People of the Book, do not overstep the bounds in your religion, or follow the people who erred and led many astray. Cursed are the unbelievers among the Children of Israel by David and Jesus.... They do vile things, allying themselves with the infidels so that Allah's indignation is upon them and in torment they will suffer for all eternity.' [Another translation reads:] 'Curses were pronounced on the unbelievers, the Children of Israel who rejected Islam, by the tongues of David and of Jesus because they disobeyed and rebelled.'
Qur'an 5:80 'You see many of them allying themselves with the unbelieving infidels. Vile indeed are their souls. Allah's wrath is on them, and in torment will they abide.'
Qur'an 5:82 'You will find the Jews and disbelievers [defined as Christians in 5:73] the most vehement in hatred for the Muslims.'
Qur'an 5:117 'I only said what You (Allah) commanded me to say: Worship Allah, my lord and your Lord. I was a witness over them while I dwelt amongst them but you took me up. (This is a great admonition and warning to the Christians of the whole world.)'.
These muslims are right, Switzerland should not ban minarets on mosques. They should ban the mosques, or better yet ban Islam and moslems, just like Saudi does with other religions. Fairs, fair aint it?
Good point Goose, a bible in some Middle Eastern countries can get you thrown in prison and converting to a less violent religion can get you killed. When that changes then we can talk about minerettes.
for more truth on islam pls visit : www.islam-watch.org , www.faithfreedom.org
if muslims want to build minaret,let them also aloow building of churches in saudi arabia,afganistan,etc all islamic countries.
if not,then no mosque or minaret.
islam is a political movement who wants to control the world.
dont allow it to take over eurpoe like it did the pagan arabs.
else all the culture and the good stuff will be lost to
islam forver.
remember the bamiyan buddhas,islam destroyed them too.
sAUDIE ARABIA IS AKINGDOM ESTABLISHED BY UK. WE HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH THEM. They are agents of occidental satanic followers.
As for other muslim countries, see for yourself jews live peacefully protected by governments as well as religious bodies so do the paganic Christians.
They have more michinaries there than those who can help the poor in Euro-American slums.
Ahh you betray your true colors, jews (with lower case J), Pagan Christians (well least you gave them an upper case C I guess). Ok my turn, muslim (lower C)who worship a deranged pedophile Bedouin peasent (mohammed, lower m)should stay in their flea infested, piss poor, medieval arse, sand pits and stick to killing each other. Instead of queing up to come to the rich peace full democratic lands of milk and honey that are the envy of all sand monkeys.
OHH, AND IF I TYPE EVERYTHING IN UPPER CASE DOES THIS MEAN YOU HAVE TO PAY MORE ATTENTION CAUSE IM SHOUTING? LOL
I have been to your Muslim countries, filthy backward and poor. That is probably why you left your little rat hole and are now infecting the west with your stupidity.
'As for other muslim countries, see for yourself jews live peacefully protected by governments as well as religious bodies so do the paganic Christians.'
Gee, in Turkey people who publish the bible were just murdered by islamists, in Lebanon a bomb just went off in the Christian quarter and in Thailand Christians were murdered by the islamist insurgency. THAT IS JUST IN TODAYS HEADLINES.
You truly are a stupid monkey.
----------------------------------------------------------------------- --------
How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy.
The effects are apparent in many countries, improvident habits, slovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live.
A degraded sensualism deprives this life of its grace and refinement the next of its dignity and sanctity. The fact that Mohammedan law every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property, either as a child, a wife, or a concubine, must delay the final extinction of slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among men.
Individual Moslems may show splendid qualities, but the influence of the religion paralyses the social development of those who follow it.
No stronger retrograde force exists in the world.... -Sir Winston Churchill
A simple building with a minaret is a threat shows how weak the mentality of the people who are endorsing such a things as to ban Minarets.
actually Christian also teaches terrorism.What did they do in iraq and afghan?And who started 9/11 ? If Christians dont invade iraq, 9/11 wont happen. Until now christian killed thousands iraqis in mid east.and thousand more waiting to be killed by US bombed in iraq and afghanistan.
Am I mistaken or its 09/11/2001 and Iraq invasion March 2003? If they mistake those dates to justify their obnoxious acts how wont they try to mislead the world about their religion (being) of peace.The issue is when anyone (whose not muslim) does any bad thing he never claims his religion orders him to, just the oposit of muslims, whose book (of peace, of course) orders them to kill anyone that refuses to submit.
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Another bad title...May 18th, 2007 - 16:38:38
'Islam foes seek to ban minarets on Swiss mosques'
They are not 'Islam Foes' they are pro Swiss.
'Swiss Foreign Minister Micheline Calmy-Rey voiced opposition this week, saying efforts to impose a ban were harmful to the country's security interests and potentially dangerous to the Swiss themselves.'
'Potentially dangerous'? In other words give them whatever they want or they might become violent.
'the mosques are our barracks, the minarets our bayonets, the domes our helmets, and the believers our soldiers.'
Some honesty at last.
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