US News
Democrats seek unity amid terse Florida-Michigan fight (3rd Roundup)
May 31, 2008, 19:40 GMT
Democratic presidential candidate U.S. Senator Barack Obama speaks at the Mapleton Expeditionary Scool of the Arts in Thorton, Colorado 28 May 2008. EPA/RICK GIASE
Washington - Supporters of presidential hopefuls Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton engaged in passionate, tense and at times testy exchanges over the disputed primaries of Florida and Michigan on Saturday as Democratic leaders battled to maintain unity and keep the party's focus on winning back the White House in November.
'We are strong enough to struggle and disagree, and even be angry and disappointed, and still come together at the end of the day and be united,' Howard Dean, chairman of the Democratic National Committee (DNC), said in opening a special meeting of the party.
Hundreds of supporters - mainly Clinton's - gathered outside a Washington hotel as the DNC's 30-member rules committee wrestled with challenges from Michigan and Florida's Democratic parties to seat their delegates.
The two states violated the party's schedule for primaries and were therefore stripped by the DNC last year of their seats at the convention in August in Denver, Colorado.
Florida officials made a passionate plea for the state's votes to be counted and often evoked the disputed 2000 presidential election, which most Democrats believe President George W Bush unfairly won over Al Gore.
'I need not tell this committee that in Florida we're pretty sensitive about having our votes taken away,' said Florida Senator Bill Nelson, who pointed out that a record number of voters turned out for the state's January 29 primary despite being told it would not count.
Michigan's Democratic Party argued the state is crucial to winning November's general election against presumed Republican candidate John McCain.
Republicans 'never fail to remind the voters of Michigan how the Democrats have ignored Michigan, don't care about Michigan and don't deserve the support of Michigan's voters in the fall,' warned Mark Brewer, chairman of the state's Democratic Party.
Reinstating Florida and Michigan's delegates is one of Clinton's last hopes of wrestling the nomination from Obama, who holds a solid lead as almost five months of state-by-state primary elections near an end. The last contests, in South Dakota and Montana, are set for June 3.
Clinton wants Florida and Michigan's January votes to be honoured in full, but faces an uphill battle for the nomination even if she does get her way. The former first lady won both contests handily, though there was no campaigning in either state and Obama's name did not appear on Michigan's ballot.
The DNC's Rules and Bylaws Committee heard from representatives of both campaigns, the states' parties and officials who filed complaints against Florida and Michigan's punishment, in an at-times raucous and heated five-hour morning meeting. Committee members were set to debate the options amongst themselves in a late-afternoon gathering.
A decision could come by the end of Saturday or early Sunday. Michigan's party officials offered a compromise that would halve Clinton's victory margin in the state, while Florida proposed seating only half the states' delegates according to the margin of the January primary.
Clinton and many state officials have argued that shutting out the two populous, key states could alienate Democratic voters in the November 4 general elections. Obama and his supporters argue he was less well-known than Clinton in January, and that the states' election results were not a fair reflection of voter preferences.
'This contest was not a normal primary election,' said Florida Congressman Robert Wexler, who on behalf of Obama's campaign said he supported the proposal for half of the state's delegates being reinstated.
The fine details of the US primary system have rarely taken on such a key role in an election. The DNC has defended last year's punishment of the two states, arguing that doing nothing would have placed the entire intra-party nomination process in jeopardy.
But some committee members expressed regret over that original ruling as all sides lamented that voters in the two states had been disenfranchised by a decision taken by party officials.
Many agreed the two states' votes were flawed - that turnout would have been much higher if voters had not been told the primaries did not count - and openly fretted over exactly what should now be done.
'I want to be fair. I want to do the right thing,' said committee member Mame Reiley, a Clinton supporter. 'Quite frankly, I'm not sure what the right thing is to do.'
COMMENT
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Older Talkback
page: 1
//www.youtube.com/watch?v=PnNmwqM2zmw
Further, deponents sayeth not.
Someone pass the popcorn...
Two very big problems with Hillary's arguments.
1) The democratic nomination process is NOT based on the popular vote. It has been based on state delegates for decades. If you want to change this rule
It is like saying after you lost a football game by 21-17 and you decide arbitrarily to say that a touchdown no longer counts for 6 points but rather 4 points. How actually thinks that is fair??
2) Second point is if you even had an argument for the popular vote case you are not counting all the votes in the caucus states as they don't record popular vote. So now you are disenfranchising all the caucus states. But apparently Hillary doesn't care about them because that would not help her losing case.
ausshgesuchnight.(?)
'Republicans 'never fail to remind the voters of Michigan how the Democrats have ignored Michigan, don't care about Michigan and don't deserve the support of Michigan's voters in the fall,' warned Mark Brewer, chairman of the state's Democratic Party. '
As I am fond of saying, and especially to you here and now, that does not make the Republicans wrong.
Chairman Brewer, it is all your doing, because the democrats have raped the voter there for the last 40 years. They are however, responsible for voting for you, so they deserve whatever they choose.
Now,Chairman Brewer, let's take a look at your state:
Business moving out as fast as it can
People leaving as fast as they can
Record murder stats in Detroit - congradulations
Record tax increases - golly what a surprise
Flat tax revenue growth - come see us, we'll intro you to Aurther Laffer
terrible livability - see for yourself
HUGE class distinctions
Having Republican leadership would be the BEST thing that ever happened to Michigan. Maybe this is the year the voters wake up.
Wunderbar, tut SP4 es wieder !
Er ust das grosste ding seit aufgeschnittenem brot.
'Obama says his ears too big for Rushmore '
(and his brain is too small)
Democrat Barack Obama paid an unscheduled late-night visit to Mount Rushmore Friday, visiting the national memorial at closing time and joking that his ears were too big to ever be included in such a display. […]
He did express curiosity about the filming of a chase scene in “North by Northwest,” Alfred Hitchcock’s 1959 classic starring Cary Grant and Eva Marie Saint that included a death-defying scramble over Rushmore’s presidential faces.
“How did they get up there in the first place?” he asked ranger Wesley Jensen.
“They didn’t. It was a movie set,” Jensen told him.
“Pretty spiffy, isn’t it,” said the Illinois senator, summing up his overall impressions.
ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5j0yiknRBE30J2EVtaA6z_0K6GJKwD910GB2G0
Well, maybe the Young Gaffer’s friends in Hollywood can explain how movies get made, at least before they actually keep their promises and bug out for Italy.
By Shireen K. Burki
Abridged:
Stafford, Va. - Osama bin Laden must be chuckling in his safe house. After all, the 2008 campaign could very well give Al Qaeda the ultimate propaganda tool: President Barack Hussein Obama, Muslim apostate.
The fact that Senator Obama – the son of a Muslim father – insists he was never a Muslim before becoming Christian is irrelevant to bin Laden. In bin Laden's eyes, Obama is a murtad fitri, the worst type of apostate, because he was blessed by Allah to be born into the true faith of Islam.
There are two types of apostates according to sharia (Islamic law) and the Hadith....
The first type is murtad milli, one who converted to Islam and later renounced the faith. The second, and most egregious, type is murtad fitri. It refers to a person born of a Muslim father who renounces his birthright. Two recent examples of the latter are Magdi Allam (a male Egyptian who converted to Catholicism in Italy) and Ayaan Hirsi Ali (Somali-born woman who's now an atheist). Both now face death threats.
According to Islamic jurisprudence, children of a Muslim father – even an apparently nonpracticing one, such as Obama's father, and irrespective of the mother's faith – are automatically Muslims. Most Muslims around the world agree: A child of a Muslim father is a Muslim. Period.
Should Obama become US commander in chief, there is a strong likelihood that Al Qaeda's media arm, As-Sahab, will exploit his background to argue that an apostate is leading the global war on terror (read: attacks against fellow Muslims). This perception would be leveraged to galvanize sympathizers into action.
Remember: Al Qaeda's ultimate goal is to restore the caliphate (the Islamic form of government that would preside over the community of believers) and expand Dar al Islam ('Abode of Islam'). Reaching it requires a long war against all – Muslim and non-Muslim – who don't share its extremist Wahhabi worldview.
Al Qaeda, though, has struggled recently to recruit volunteers for this jihad. While bin Laden retains significant support as someone willing to stand up for Muslim concerns, most Muslims abhor Al Qaeda's terrorist methods whose primary targets are innocent noncombatants.
But an apostate as head of the United States could change this equation. It would be a propaganda boost for Al Qaeda's mission. All one has to do is read Al Qaeda's public statements to recognize how frequently it makes baseless apostasy accusations against fellow Muslims who challenge its message or actions.
That's why Obama is bin Laden's dream candidate.
[...]
So far, Al Qaeda has been conspicuously quiet on Obama's candidacy. But that should not come as a surprise. Hoping Obama gets elected, they're probably waiting until he's taken the oath of office to begin branding him a traitor to the faith of his fathers.
Islamic terrorists know that the long road to success lies in stoking the 'clash of civilizations.' To reach their goal of restoring the Caliphate in a form that fits their worldview, they need massive numbers of Muslims to join their global jihad.
Bin Laden and his followers have already shown their willingness to exploit real or imagined religious schisms to expand their support base. So it's not hard to imagine bin Laden praying that Obama wins this November.
news.yahoo.com/s/csm/20080519/cm_csm/yburki
'Bin Laden and his followers have already shown their willingness to exploit real or imagined religious schisms to expand their support base. So it's not hard to imagine bin Laden praying that Obama wins this November.'
Hard to disagree with that....
www.weeklystandard.com/Weblogs/TWSFP/TWSFPView.asp#7129
On MSNBC today, David Axelrod said that Barack Obama 'never disputed the fact that if you throw a surge of American soldiers in an area that you can make a difference.'
Oh really? Here's what Obama said on January 14, 2007: 'We can send 15,000 more troops, 20,000 more troops, 30,000 more troops: I don't know any expert on the region or any military officer that I've spoken to privately that believes that that is going to make a substantial difference on the situation on the ground.'
Watch it:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4vlBgh7KLg
So, half of the U.S. is suspicious of McCain, the war monger, and the other half are suspicious of Clinton, the covert socialists, or Obama, the closet muslim.
The 'united we stand' America is a figment of the imagination. U.S. citizens simply do not know their politicians and they spend billions of dollars trying to out propagandize each other to the point where even the candidates forget who they are and represent nothing but greed.
So get out, go back to the middle east.
Now the headline at CNN.com:
Barack Obama has resigned as a member of the Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago, his campaign says.
He’s doing it on a Saturday afternoon to try to avoid as much media frenzy as possible.
Good news: Obama is now free to return to his muslim roots.
'Good news: Obama is now free to return to his muslim roots.'
Well, at least you do not speak with forked tongue. It is nice for someone to admit their bigotry of muslims so straight forwardly. McCain has to keep a lid on it to appease all the christians that will vote for him that do not want to admit their bigotry.
Or am I not getting something? What is wrong with being muslim, or having muslim roots?
And again we here from the right wing of M&C---too bad their opinion does not have any bearing on what is happening, or is going to happen. Blah, blah, blah, about as much credibility as a banana slug.
In the day and age we live in, where we can, at the touch of buttons, hear what these chuckleheads were saying a week, month or a year ago, we STILL have these believers who are willing to ignore it all and put their blind trust in the prettiest, blackest, or most female candidate.
All these tools and yet we are no different. We deserve what ever we get.
'we STILL have these believers who are willing to ignore it all and put their blind trust in the prettiest, blackest, or most female candidate.'
Need I remind you:
- Obama is as white as he is black, not that it matters.
- Hilary is NOT a female, contrary to scientific evidence, not that it matters.
- McCain is hardly pretty, not that it matters.
- Blind trust: Yes, absolutely. Bush is a good example of that. Mission accomplished.
''Good news: Obama is now free to return to his muslim roots.''
'Well, at least you do not speak with forked tongue. It is nice for someone to admit their bigotry of muslims so straight forwardly. '
Truth isn't bigotry.
'Or am I not getting something? '
You are a terrorist apologist, antisemitic, anti-American POS... You are not getting out fast enough is what you are not getting.
'What is wrong with being muslim, or having muslim roots?'
When you use it for justification of your own prejudice as you have? Lets face it, in your case at least it is another excuse to hate Jews, disparage the USA and hope for the subservience of the infidel.
I will not submit...
'- Hilary is NOT a female, contrary to scientific evidence, not that it matters.'
Why, because she doesn't cover her head or keep a few paces behind the men?
Women don't do that here, one day they wont have to do it anywhere; deal with it.
'I will not submit...'
Submit to what?
- Having a female president (hat or no hat) is OK.
- Having a black or white president is OK.
- Having a christian, muslim or jewish president is OK.
- Having a ugly or pretty president is OK.
The only thing you need submit to is tolerance.
'The only thing you need submit to is tolerance.'
Lance on Americans:
'In general the U.S. population is comprised of spoiled brats that get their way and when they don't they whine, whine, whine.'
'The holocaust (genocide) on the American Indian ethnic groups and nations was incredibly more successful than that of the Germans on the Jews.'
'... oh yeah ... and anyone that contradicts the glorious history of the U.S. is a terrorist.'
'It is amazing that there are so many marginally operative constituents and politicians in the U.S.'
On Christians:
'Well, christians[sic] are no better than islamists.
On Catholics:
'... a different country where they harbor child abusers and people (like Law) who turn a blind eye to mass child abuse. So maybe he is talking about HIS society. '
On the Pope: (Lance doesn't like the pope very much)
'So, was he talking about the diplomatic efforts to promote the Nation Of Islam? And make the entire world a muslim brotherhood? And if not, why not? Surely the muslim efforts should be promoted and conversion to being muslim is progress.'
'The buildings and furnishings look expensive and grand. No evidence that he could partake in the instruments of mass child rape.'
'I hope the pope also asked for God's intercession in the hate which drove the christian leaders to kill so many in Iraq. He does sound very biased though.'
On the pope advocating Christ... 'I wonder if he actually realizes how condescending that is to most people.'
on freedom:
'In Iraq everyone already has religious freedom: The right to practice religion as long as that religion is muslim.'
On remembering the victims of islamist murder:
It is way past time to move on. 9/11 happened a long time ago and people should not bring it up over and over again in order to justify attacking Iraq and other people.
On being insane:
'Bush and the pope should strongly affirm the right to be muslim and how good it is.'
'When Bush kneels at the feet of muslim leaders like he does the pope (a symbolism of his singling out and bias) then you might have a point.'
'Perhaps the U.S. should elect a muslim president as I suspect that would go a long way to infusing understanding into the U.S. government.'
''It makes no difference either way so why not make it 50% of the time a muslim president and the other 50% a christian president.''
On justifying terrorism:
'I would be more concerned about christian aggression (to muslim states) and how that is creating a mess.'
' Anyone who stands up for the truth is call a terrorist.'
'the invasion of Iraq and subsequent mass killing of muslims that resisted the invasion was accomplished by christians[sic].''
So? What is your point? It is all true:
(1) christians are no better (or worse) than muslims
(2) the pope should affirm (over and over again) non-violence against muslims.
(3) there has never been a muslim U.S. president, but there should be; say 50/50 split. That sounds even to me.
(4) the american indian holocaust was worse than that of the jewish holocaust.
(5) child abusers are protected within the vatican
(6) Bush and the pope should strongly affirm the right to be muslim and how good it is.
(7) the invasion of Iraq and subsequent mass killing of muslims that resisted the invasion was accomplished by christians. Duh, that is obviously true ... the U.S. is a christian nation.
So, what is your point? I'm just stating the obvious.
Aaah the primitive mind in action... You basically say that hate for us is justified by your culture and if anyone objects to that they are a bigot.
(1) Show me the passage in the bible that advocates constant jihad against all non-Christians. I have posted dozens of quotes from the koran which state basically that.
(2) The ayatollahs, mufti's imams, etc, should affirm (over and over again) non-violence against Christians, Jews, polytheists, atheists, agnostics and everyone else. You will NEVER see that because it would be contrary to the teachings of islam.
(3)Yup, at 2% of the population and you already think that sounds 'even'. Seeing that here to fore the only successful democracy in the middle east is the Jewish state you might want to start there.
(4)That is simply hogwash. Regardless, does that make it OK to drive the Israelis in to the sea in a second shot at completing the job?
(5)Terrorists are protected by muslims... I have never been abused by a priest but I saw 9/11.
(6)Ahmadinejad and the grand mufti should strongly affirm the right to be a jew, Christian, polytheists, atheists, infidel, kuffar or anything else and allow the free practice of ALL religions in the middle east. You will NEVER see that because it would be contrary to the teachings of islam.
(7) The mass killings in Iraq have been done mostly by other muslims. That is the middle eastern way of voting. The USA a Christian nation? OK, sure, fine... By your own assertion that means you need to start packing.
Don't waste your time debating these mu-slime they are the worst kind of scum, they will not answer any real questions, they hide out in the west cause their own countries are backwards and piss poor. They don't have any real courage but love to kill little girls and boys in the name of the sick cult they worship. They are second class citizens in their host countries cause the peoples of the west sense their ignorance and medievalism, and the best they can do is come here and spew their anti-west-Jewish-Christian hate, its all they have (apart from their strange relations with their donkeys). Could not believe that 'Iranian' admits to owning a donkey and getting tissues in the same post...hahahah too funny.
RE:'But some committee members expressed regret over that original ruling as all sides lamented that voters in the two states had been disenfranchised by a decision taken by party officials.'
This one is highly amusing and the root of the problem is Governor Dean. He is a truly lousy strategist. By stating the nature of these sanctions in advance, he all but guaranteed that the Republicans in state legislatures would be eager to move their primaries forward, because the GOP sanctions were not nearly so draconian in nature.
What does this mean? Well, for starters, Democrats are not particularly democratic. The current crop is reflected in the nature of Howard Dean. They are dogmatic ideologues who will do ANYTHING they deem necessary to turn the United States into yet another socialist third world power.
Two classes of citizens benefit the most from this, the very wealthy and the bureaucrats. The poor get a few more crumbs for a little while and the middle-class dangles from the gallows.
I am definitely voting for Barak Obama. I want to find out if Americans have turned into mindless sheeple or not. They might surprise and grow a set.
'(2) The ayatollahs, mufti's imams, etc, should affirm (over and over again) non-violence against Christians, Jews, polytheists, atheists, agnostics and everyone else'
You are absolutely right, they should.
You are right, right and right. You are so right.
Thank you! Affirming non-violence against all, especially for those not of your clan, over and over and over again is a good thing.
Not doing violence is even better. Lets here it for non-violence!
may christians pull out of Iraq now! and not participate in the violence!
'(6)Ahmadinejad and the grand mufti should strongly affirm the right to be a jew, christian, polytheists, atheists, infidel, kuffar or anything else and allow the free practice of ALL religions in the middle east.'
Yes! Absolutely. And they should also commit to not evangelizing each other and saying stupid things like jesus is the only way to heaven, or there is only one god, or god is the only way to salvation, etc. etc.
... but, then religion would be completely arbitrary. You can get to heaven on a donkey! But, that is exactly right: religion is arbitrary!
'may christians pull out of Iraq now! and not participate in the violence!'
Sure... and reward islamist violence?
'Yes! Absolutely. '
Again, you miss the point, they will not. They can not because to do so would be against their specific religion.
Trying to draw a moral equivalence between a society that allows others to worship freely and one that doesn't or more precisely, one that holds bake sales to send people to do work for the underprivileged (as I saw today) and one that stones people to death for infidelity is inherently idiotic, and entirely in keeping with your presentation here.
'... but, then religion would be completely arbitrary. '
No, you can change it, there is free will... Well, unless you were born a muslim in the middle east, then they will kill you for changing religions.
'then they [some of them] will kill you for changing religions'
That is because you become essentially an animal. Even christians eat animals.
In western religions, like christianity, you become 'one of the unchosen', or 'doomed to hell', or whatever.
Either way the result is the same: In both religions if you convert then you are deemed to be terminal without any after life or eternal bliss. Sometimes the muslims just help it along a little faster. Christians use to do the same thing a few 100 years ago, but I know of no cases where they do it in general now. The last time christians mass killed pagan human animals was when they discovered the new world. Well, they also mass killed gooks in Vietnam and other places, but I don't exactly think it was because they were pagans. It is just that they were easy to burn the flesh off with napalm and carpet bombing, and heck they were pagan animal unchosen ones, which made it easier.
So, both religions are, for all practical purposes, the same thing: Violent.
'That is because you become essentially an animal. Even christians eat animals.'
Great, so a human being who leaves islam of their own free will is nothing better then an animal to be eaten.
'In western religions, like christianity, you become 'one of the unchosen', or 'doomed to hell', or whatever.'
Do you get murdered? Well, no, no you don't. I know several people who have changed their religions, none of them were murdered. Eventyally no one was even telling them that they were ''doomed to hell', or whatever.' See, 'lance' again, you fail in your pathetic attempt to draw some kind of moral equivalence. There is none.
'
Either way the result is the same: In both religions if you convert then you are deemed to be terminal without any after life or eternal bliss. '
Once again, IDIOT, the results are not the same. Convert from Islam in Iran or Saudi Arabia and they will murder you. In other islamic countries they will as well. They will not do that in civilization.
'The last time christians mass killed pagan human animals was when they discovered the new world. Well, they also mass killed gooks in Vietnam and other places, but I don't exactly think it was because they were pagans'
Show me a passage in the bible where it requires Christians to do that. As we both know at this point, there is plenty in the Koran that advocates violance against the kuffar. Indeed, you divide the whole world into 'pure' and 'unclean' the deen and infidel...
That is the fatal flaw in your argument. In the case of Christianity at least, when Christians commit murder it isn't because their faith instructs them to; it is in spite of their faith. When Muslims murder in the name of islam it is because of what they have been told to do in the Koran.
'So, both religions are, for all practical purposes, the same thing: Violent.'
Wrong.
KORAN commands to kill infidels:
Allah is an enemy to unbelievers. - Sura 2:98
On unbelievers is the curse of Allah. - Sura 2:161
Slay them wherever ye find them and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. - 2:191
Fight against them until idolatry is no more and Allah's religion reigns supreme. (different translation: ) Fight them until there is no persecution and the religion is God's entirely. - Sura 2:193 and 8:39
Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you dislike it. - 2:216
(different translation: ) Prescribed for you is fighting, though it is hateful to you.
..... martyrs.... Enter heaven - Surah 3:140-43
If you should die or be killed in the cause of Allah, His mercy and forgiveness would surely be better than all they riches they amass. If you should die or be killed, before Him you shall all be gathered. - 3:157-8
You must not think that those who were slain in the cause of Allah are dead. They are alive, and well-provided for by their Lord. - Surah 3:169-71
Let those fight in the cause of God who sell the life of this world for the hereafter. To him who fights in the cause of God, whether he is slain or victorious, soon we shall give him a great reward. - Surah 4:74
Those who believe fight in the cause of God, and those who reject faith fight in the cause of evil. - 4:76
But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever you find them. - 4:89
Therefore, we stirred among them enmity and hatred, which shall endure till the Day of Resurrection, when Allah will declare to them all that they have done. - 5:14
O believers, take not Jews and Christians as friends; they are friends of each other. Those of you who make them his friends is one of them. God does not guide an unjust people. - 5:54
Make war on them until idolatry is no more and Allah's religion reigns supreme - 8:39
O Prophet! Exhort the believers to fight. If there are 20 steadfast men among you, they shall vanquish 200; and if there are a hundred, they shall rout a thousand unbelievers, for they are devoid of understanding. - 8:65
It is not for any Prophet to have captives until he has made slaughter in the land. - 8:67
Allah will humble the unbelievers. Allah and His apostle are free from obligations to idol-worshipers. Proclaim a woeful punishment to the unbelievers. - 9:2-3
When the sacred months are over, slay the idolaters wherever you find them. Arrest them, besiege them, and lie in ambush everywhere for them. - 9:5
Believers! Know that idolators are unclean. - 9:28
Fight those who believe neither in God nor the Last Day, nor what has been forbidden by God and his messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, even if they are People of the Book, until they pay the tribute and have been humbled. - 9:29 (another source: ) The unbelievers are impure and their abode is hell. (another source: ) Humiliate the non-Muslims to such an extent that they surrender and pay tribute.
Whether unarmed or well-equipped, march on and fight for the cause of Allah, with your wealth and your persons. - 9:41
O Prophet! Make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites. Be harsh with them. Their ultimate abode is hell, a hapless journey's end. - 9:73
Allah has purchased of their faithful lives and worldly goods, and in return has promised them the Garden. They will fight for His cause, kill and be killed. - 9:111
Fight unbelievers who are near to you. 9:123 (different translation:
Believers! Make war on the infidels who dwell around you. Let them find harshness in you. (another source: ) Ye who believe! Murder those of the disbelievers....
As for those who are slain in the cause of Allah, He will not allow their works to perish. He will vouchsafe them guidance and ennoble their state; He will admit them to the Paradise He has made known to them. - 10:4-15
Allah has cursed the unbelievers and proposed for them a blazing hell. - 33:60
Unbelievers are enemies of Allah and they will roast in hell. - 41:14
When you meet the unbelievers, smite their necks, then when you have made wide slaughter among them, tie fast the bonds, then set them free, either by grace or ransom, until the war lays down its burdens. - 47:4
(different translation: ) When you meet the unbelievers in the battlefield, strike off their heads, and when you have laid them low, bind your captives firmly.
Those who are slain in the way of Allah - he will never let their deeds be lost. Soon will he guide them and improve their condition, and admit them to the Garden, which he has announced for them. - 47:5
Muslims are harsh against the unbelievers, merciful to one another. - 48:25
Muhammad is Allah's apostle. Those who follow him are ruthless to the unbelievers but merciful to one another. Through them, Allah seeks to enrage the unbelievers. - 48:29
Prophet! Make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites and deal sternly with them. Hell shall be their home, evil their fate. - 66:9
The unbelievers among the People of the Book and the pagans shall burn forever in the fire of hell. They are the vilest of all creatures. - 98:51
Fight them so that Allah may punish them at your hands, and put them to shame. (verse cited in Newsweek 2/11/02)
... still trying to prove that you are better than muslim.
now we know what makes wars and why people kill people.
'.. still trying to prove that you are better than muslim.'
My inherent 'worth' is irrelevant, the quality of my theology (or lack thereof) is certainly more humane then that which is taught as 'islam'.
'now we know what makes wars and why people kill people.'
Well, in this case, because the Koran tells them to.
page: 1
COUNT ALL VOTES, what is so hard about that?May 31st, 2008 - 19:43:14
I’m watching the DNC Rules Committee’s hilarious farce of a hearing right now. The Democrats are tearing themselves apart before our very eyes. Right now, the members are listening to a proposal from the Michigan Democrats to… Well, it seems like they want to allocate the Michigan Delegates 69-59 Clinton, a number which they appear to have arrived at through the scientific method of pulling it out of one’s ass. Literally, I’m sitting here watching representatives of one of the supposedly great parties in the land trying to decide who wins by guessing who people might have voted for.
I’m not making this up. At this moment, the people who want to decide the Democratic Nomination are trying to surmise who write-in voters might have voted for, and trying to project results based on exit polls.
Speaking of “counting every vote”, a few other interesting tidbits.
As of now, if you count every single person who went and voted in a Democratic Primary or Caucus, more Democrats have voted for Hillary Clinton than Barack Obama. After all, is said and done, when you count every vote, Hillary Clinton is going to lead the popular vote among all Democrats by, oh, half a million votes or so.
Oh, I know, I know – that’s the rules and all of that. And I don’t have anything against that. But one wonders what happened to all of the Democrats in 2000 who were outraged, outraged at the idea of the person who got the most votes not winning the election. The rules weren’t the rules when they were making up new ways of count the Florida ballots eight years ago.
This is also interesting. Barack Obama, it seems, won his first election by having all of his opponents’ names thrown off of the ballot – with his primary challenger being removed for having some of the names on her nomination petitions printed rather than in cursive writing. And we all know that he won his Senate election by default. He’s winning this nomination here as a result of the same back room tactics.
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